MyStake Casino - Player’s requesting a full deposit refund.

Hi,

I was a customer with Rolletto Casino and also registered with Mystake as they are both owned and operated by Onyxion. I requested that I be self excluded with Rolletto due to gambling issues and they did not ban the mystake account too. Because of this I was able to deposit a further €756 into Mystake. Because the casinos are both operated by Onyxion a customer should be banned from all sites under that umbrella. I have requested a refund of €756 and the account to be closed. This has not been done yet. I hope you can help with this. The support agents state that Rolletto and Mystake are 2 different companies but that is incorrect, the Licences both point to Onyxion and are registered to the same address. If you can help with this I would be extremely grateful.

Thanks

Dear eatme84lee,

Thank you very much for submitting your complaint. I’m sorry to hear about your problem. I have checked the Responsible Gaming section of Rolletto Casino, and this is what I found https://rolletto.com/en/static/terms/responsiblegaming:

"Self Exclusion

If the situation is more serious, you may want to exclude yourself from gambling for an extended period of time. You can contact our Customer Support team at any time requesting self exclusion for a period of between 6 months and 5 years."

Unfortunately, there’s not written that all your accounts in other casinos of the same owner will be blocked or self-excluded automatically. Please understand that if you self-exclude yourself from one casino it doesn’t necessarily mean that you are protected on all the other associated websites. Could you please advise if you have requested a self-exclusion from MyStake Casino directly?

Looking forward to hearing from you.

Best regards,

Petronela

Hi,

It does not make sense that they would not block all accounts, they state that they take responsible gambling seriously, its very irresponsible of them not to do that.

For example if I self excluded with a casino operated by Genesis Global Limited I would be self excluded over all there casinos. Yes I have now requested it to be closed and its not happened yet.

I feel its the casino that's in the wrong here, I'm responsible for letting them know about gambling problems and they are responsible for protecting me after that across all sister sites.

Thanks

I fully understand your point of view and I agree that it would be ideal if a player had their accounts blocked across the entire group simultaneously, unfortunately, that's not a standard procedure.

Please keep me informed about your recent request to self-exclude from MyStake Casino. Thank you in advance.

Hi,

It is standard practice and also common sense. If a player tells you they have a gambling issue then as a company who promotes responsible gambling you would block them across all sites that Onyxion operate. Any casino I have excluded from they have excluded me across the whole group especially if I say it's due to gambling issues.

Could you please forward any relevant communication between you and both casinos to petronela.k@casino.guru? Thank you very much in advance.

The first time it was mentioned to Mystake was 12th August yes. But as stated Onyxion which operates both casinos have know about it longer. Onyxion are the people who block and ban the accounts

Have you deposited any funds into your MyStake Casino account after the 12th of August?

Hi

Yes €411 after 12th of August when the account should have already been closed by mystake

Could you please forward a payment receipt, please?

Hi,

I have sent you an email with more attachments and a timeline of events.

Thanks

Yes, I have received it. If you have sent a request on the 12th and the casino replied to you that "your account remained opened until you have clearly stated that you wanted to close your account because of gambling addiction problems", could you please advise if you have sent any other self-exclusion requests after the 12th of August?

The screenshot you are referring to is not the reply from the email I sent on the 12/08/21. I have already sent the screenshot with the reply I received from that one.

I understand, thank you very much, eatme84lee, for providing all the necessary information. Since it looks as the request for self-exclusion has been granted after one week I will now transfer your complaint to my colleague Jozef who will be at your assistance. I wish you best of luck and hope to see your problem being resolved to your satisfaction in the near future.

Hello eatme84lee,

I absolutely appreciate that you shared your experiences with the Casino Guru team. We will now try to get in touch with the casino.

Hi Mystake.

First of all it seems whoever has read my email has just ignored the parts where I mention gambling issues and mental health. You also clearly state on your site that your staff are trained for Responsible Gaming. The subject of that email was refund request and account closure. I also wrote on the end of the email to close the account. The request is clear as day and if you see someone mention about gambling issues you close there account. The excuse you gave is just not good enough. I think Casino Guru may agree with me on this.

Hello eatme84lee,

I am very sorry about the situation, but we believe that the casino team is not obligated to refund your deposit since they were not aware of your addiction. Although they might share the registered name of Onyxion, it is common that they are run by different companies and different managing teams (that means that they cannot share information about their players). Therefore, your account should have been blocked without a chance to reopen right after you informed the Mystake casino about your addiction.

Please, could you specify their behavior after they found out about your gambling problem?

I have also one additional question, have you received any confirmation email where it was stated that

self-exclusion applies across all the Onyxion casinos?

HI Josef,

The refund I am requesting in this dispute is after I told them about my gambling issues and they didn't block anything until I spoke to them again after my deposits. I did request a refund before I told them about gambling issues which the refused but they still didn't block my account after that which resulted in more deposits taking place. MyStake still don't feel it warrants a refund

Dear My Stake Casino team.

Thank you very much for your cooperation in this case. Please, could you explain why the player's account has not been blocked after he informed you about his gambling problem? Although he does not deserve to receive the refund before 12th August, after 12th August you were clearly aware of his addiction and the best practice would be to block his account asap.

Yes I agree I do not deserve the refund before 12th August as apparently onyxion does not operate both mystake and rolletto. But the deposits after 12th August when you were clearly made aware of my gambling issues should be refunded as you had read and acknowledged my email

Dear Jozef,

First of all, we want to ask the indicated user to present the proof of him requesting to block his account on MyStake due to his gambling addiction.

The only proof we know exists is the above-attached screenshot of the e-mail player sent us on the 12th of August where we can read: "Once the refund is complete I would also like this account to be banned too".

It should also be taken into consideration that the refund the player mentions, is regarding the amount he lost on the different brand (Rolletto to be particular).

Once again, 1st e-mail we got from the player on the 12th of August was about the refund, which we found unreasonable for known reasons, and the 2nd e-mail was about the card verification as you can see in the attached screenshots above.

To be clear, we do not have any obligation to close anyone's player account due to the information the player has provided to a different brand. Other than that, there was an ongoing dispute regarding the refund user requested so we did not find it appropriate to close the user's account until the dispute had been finalized.

Lastly, it is clearly stated in our Responsible Gaming section that one requesting self-exclusion shall indicate the specific period for the exclusion (see the attached screenshot), which is also nowhere to be found in the e-mail we received from the indicated user.

Firstly the refund originally requested was from the deposits on Mystake and not Rolletto.

I am requesting a full refund of all deposits amounting to €756 please. The reason I am requesting this is because when my account was closed with Rolletto due to gambling issues because of my mental health condition my account with MyStake should have been closed too as its owned and operated by the same company Onyxion.  

My account with Rolletto was closed when my account with MyStake was already registered yet you still allowed me access.

You can clearly see there I state I have gambling problems based on my mental health.

I clearly state at the end of the email aswell to close my account after the refund. You replied to this on 12th August and you already gave the resolution to that dispute by stating you was not going to refund me but you did not close my account as requested.

You also state the following on your responsible gambling page:

"It is our responsibility to ensure that all of our staff are trained to recognise any signs of problem gambling, and to take the necessary steps to protect our members".

Before I sent my original email dated 12th August I spoke with a member of your live support who was also made aware of my gambling issues. So your staff member could have taken steps then as mentioned above.

Your reply to the email was that you have nothing to do with rolletto which I know is incorrect as I have spoken with Curacao Gaming Control Board who says Onyxion operate both Rolletto and Mystake. Also you didn't close the account as requested. Its not very difficult to see the request so I don't understand why it was not done immediately when you are meant to be a responsible Igaming company.

I would also like to provide the following from your privacy policy page

You stated in a reply on here a week ago the following:

"To start with, both of the casinos are registered under the name of Onyxion, however, MyStake and Rolletto are 2 completely different companies, run by completely different managing teams (Live Support as well). So the information you may have sent to Rolletto's Live Support, is not available for MyStake's Live Support team"

The privacy policy above contradicts your argument it clearly states that all the parents companies subsidiaries etc have access to all my details within the Onyxion group. So MyStake can see if I have Blocked my account with Rolletto. I'm sorry but after reading that I believe both requests for refunds are reasonable.

Dear Casino Guru Team,

Once again, one requesting self-exclusion shall indicate the specific period for the exclusion, shall clearly indicate that he/she wants to have his/her account closed which is nowhere to be found in the e-mails we received from the indicated user ("Once the refund is complete I would also like this account to be banned too" - this request includes a prerequisite in itself, which isn't fulfilled, therefore, the latter part of the statement couldn't have been considered as the clear request of the account closure as well).

We believe we've already presented our arguments over all the disputed matters not once, but several times. Therefore, we do not see any point in further discussion with the user.

Please, examine the case carefully and we'll be waiting for your decision.

Just to add I spoke with Todd on Live Support on 20th August after my further deposits when my account should have been closed. Todd blocked my deposit methods, so how was he able to do this if your process is that we have to request self exclusion? Also why were my deposit methods not blocked previously when I spoke to Live Support on 12th August? See Mystake you have immediate actions you can take to stop people depositing but you decide to take them when it's too late. I will leave this in the capable hands of Casino Guru. Mystakes arguments are not plausible.

Hello MyStake Casino team.

There are types of self-exclusions that are for predefined periods, but not for players that express their addiction. It is standard in the industry to permanently block players who even slightly express gambling issues (without a chance to reopen or in specific cases with a relevant cooling-off period).

In the email above (12th August), the player requested the refund, and indeed his request was irrelevant since you were not aware of his gambling problem. But, after this email, he did mention it and even requested you to ban his account, which was ignored. I understand that your team focused on his refund request, but his account should have been blocked asap.

May I kindly ask you to reevaluate your decision, or is it final?

Casino Guru, can I just make a valid point please. MyStake state on this dispute that them and Rolletto are different, yet on another dispute on this site with Mystake they mention that a customer has an account with them and Rolletto. Do they only say they are separate companies when it suits them? It seems to me that data is shared between Mystake and Rolletto under the privacy policy so they would be very well informed of my account closure with Rolletto for gambling issues.

If Mystake reconsider there decision and agree with Casino Guru then I will accept just the refund for all deposits after 12th August.

Hi,

Because I knew Mystake or Onyxion would make excuses about refunding I decided to speak to the police and the UK Gambling Commission . They advised me to chargeback as companies who do not hold a valid UKGC Licence are not allowed to transact with UK Customers its illegal. So this is being treated by Action Fraud in the UK as Misrepresentation by the Casino. Thanks for trying to help anyway Casino Guru. Mystake had no intention of ever refunding the amounts. I've seen this from other forums too. If Mystake and Rolletto were allowed to accept UK Customers they would have to integrate Gamstop and would have seen I have been on Gamstop since 2019 for 5 years.

Also I would like to add that Mystake have provided information from Rolletto in there reply even though they said that they can't share information as its a separate company. Again complete lies. Mystake and Rolletto both have my KYC documents so when they send them to the acquiring bank its going to show the proof that they knowingly accepted a UK player illegally.

Dear Casino Guru team,

The indicated user has an ongoing dispute with a payment provider, on which a final decision has not yet been made. As you know, the above user requests a refund from us even though the service has already been provided from our side (requests a refund on the grounds that the service was not received from us). Therefore, we are waiting for the bank's decision in order to avoid refunding the amount to the customer twice (from us and from the bank).

On average this chargeback process may even take several months, so at this point, we will refrain from crediting the disputed amount to the customer.

As Mystake and Rolletto should already know they are not allowed to transact with UK Customers without a UKGC Licence. A Curaçao Licence only makes it illegal for them to do so. These Casinos should block UK Customers from registering like other Curacao Casinos have. The Curaçao Gaming Control Board mentioned they will be removing Licences from Companies that are not abiding by there Licence which means it is the Casinos responsibility to make sure they can legally offer there services in different countries. Even the Casino Guru site mentions that Mystake and Rolletto are not available to UK Customers. Also if some of your Providers find out that you are offering there games to UK Customers without a UKGC Licence they will remove all there games from your site.

Hello there.

After evaluation of all the information in the case, we consider this case as justified. Although the casino team was not aware of the player's addiction, they were clearly informed about his problem when he did request a refund. After the email I have also mentioned in my previous message, the player's account should have been permanently blocked. The casino team has clearly expressed that they are not going to change their decision, therefore we are forced to close this case as 'unresolved'. 

Eatme84lee, I would normally recommend you to contact the licensing authority, but since you have requested chargeback it is no longer a relevant option.

Best regards, Jozef

We’ve reopened this complaint as per the casino's request. We would like to give this case one more chance to get resolved and help both involved parties to reach to a satisfactory conclusion.

Dear eatme84lee,

The casino team informed us that you requested chargebacks for your deposits. Please, could you confirm if it is true and if they were successful?

Hi yes I did on the basis that they should have already closed my account as there sister company Rolletto did. Rolletto was made aware of my gambling issues and I know for a fact that Mystske has the same information. They should have not taken my deposits and they should have closed my account. No I was not successful with the chargeback

I don't understand why they want this complaint reopened after 2 years? They already made my life hell and its bringing it all up again. Are they trying to finally sort this out and resolve the situation with me? Or are they just trying to increase there rating on your site by saying I'm in the wrong?

Hi, I'm glad you responded.

You're correct, the casino team would like to resolve the case, and if the chargebacks were unsuccessful, they should issue a refund. Do you have any supporting documents/evidence that would prove the chargebacks were unsuccessful?

Of course I have attached them below

This bank account is now no longer active so if they wanted to refund me they would need alternative details from me.

Dear MyStake Casino team,

may I kindly ask you to react?

Hello eatme84lee,

You have uploaded screenshots of rejected refund requests from July. However, this complaint is regarding deposits made after August 12th. Could you please provide similar proof of deposit disputes of August?

Best regards,

Dear eatme84lee,

Could you please provide the documents requested by the casino team?

Certainly I have attached this now.

Sorry about the delay in sending the proof @mystake and @casinoguru I was in hospital for a week and did not see the response

@mystake I've provided what was requested, could you please respond. If you are wanting to refund me to resolve this dispute that went against you back in 2021 then lets discuss it. You would need to send it to my crypto wallet though as my bank accounts from back then are all closed. Please let me and Casinoguru know your intentions for reopening this complaint.

Thanks

Hi Mystake Casino,

Any response yet please?

I don't think MyStake are going to respond Jozef, I don't know why they even bothered to reopen the case. It's just brought back bad memories for me again

Hello eatme84lee,

Thanks for providing all the proofs. Considering all the details, we decided to refund you all the transactions you made on August 19.

The total sum is 411.5 euros.

We will temporarily enable your MyStake account so you can request a withdrawal with crypto, as you insisted.

If we are in agreement, please confirm it, and we will proceed with the above-mentioned procedure.

Best regards,

Hi Mystake I am happy to agree to that and deem the matter rectified once I have withdrawn the crypto. Please let me know once the account is open and I'll let CasinoGuru know through here once I have withdrawn. Thankyou very much for your decision.

Hi @MyStake, I'm trying to sign in but it says user blocked

Hi @MyStake,

I am now able to sign into my account, I'm now just waiting for the 411.5 euros to be refunded to the mystake balance so I can withdraw.

Thankyou

Hello eatme84lee,

Your account has been temporarily unlocked. You can now sign in and make a withdrawal request.

Hi @MyStake

I cam confirm I have a crypto withdrawal processing now. Once it is complete I will update this case.

Thankyou

Still waiting for the crypto withdrawal to be processed from over 2 hours ago

Dear eatme84lee,

I am very glad to see we are close to the resolution. I am extending the timer by 7 days, please, let us know when you receive it.

Hi Jozef, I can confirm the withdrawal has been received and this case can now be closed.

@MyStake thankyou for finally sorting this out, it did take 2 years but I'm happy that you want to continue improving as a casino and I wish you all the best

Thank you for kind words, eatme84lee.

We hope that you have overcome your addiction and are now feeling better.

Best regards,

Dear eatme84lee,

Thank you for using the Casino Guru complaint resolution center. We are glad to hear that your issue got resolved. We will now mark it as 'resolved' in our system. Please, do not hesitate to contact us in the future, if you run into any issues with this or any other casino. We are here to help, but I hope you won’t come across a problem like this again.

Best regards, Jozef