Winstoria Casino - The player demands a refund.

Hi. I made account in winstoria few days ago and started playing. Few hours ago i noticed that its altacore nv owned casino. I went to chat and said that i am blocked from several altacore nv casinos stelario , cosmonaut dozenspins etc. Chat then said that i am not allowed to play here. Then i said that then i am allowed to have my all deposits refunded made to winstoria. Chat said that write to kyc about that issue. No answers has come to me.. Since i am not allowed to play and never even gotten winnings out off the casino its fair to have my deposits refunded am i right?

Hello Purnojahakka,

Thank you very much for submitting your complaint and I'm really sorry to hear about your issue with Winstoria Casino. Please allow me to ask you a few more question before we would move forward.

What is the reason you are blocked in the other casinos - was it gambling issue related? When exactly did you contact the KYC department of the casino? Is your account currently still active?

If you are self-excluded in any of their casino, and they have a self-exclusion for the whole group, you should get back all of your deposits. It really depends on many factors as some casinos may allow you to play even if you are blocked in their sister casino.

Looking forward to your answer.

Regards,

Nick

Because of a gambling problem. And the chat also told me when I asked if I could play here even though I have closed accounts for stelario, cosmonaut, dozenspins, allreels. So the chat said I wasn’t allowed to play on the winstory. I put the message on Saturday.

in that more recent chat that chat makes sure I don't get to play. I should have been blocked immediately at the registration stage.

If chat says that i am not allowed to play here then all deposits should be refunded.

still no answers. Not from kyc , not fron support. Guru please help me to get my deposits refunded!

Hello Purnojahakka and thank you for all the information. I will now forward your complaint to my colleague Branislav who will be assisting you from now on.

Wish you best luck resolving it.

Regards,

Nick

Ok. Still no answers..

Hello, Purnojahakka,

I am sorry to hear about your experience. I will contact the casino and try my best to resolve the issue as soon as possible. Now I would like to invite Winstoria Casino's representative to join this conversation and participate in the resolution of this complaint.

Dear Winstoria Casino Team,

Could you please explain to us the player's situation? Will his deposits be returned to him?

Thank you in advance for providing the information.

Dear Purnojahakka.

We have reviewed your appeal in detail. 

We have requested data on your account from our partner Stelario Casino. On the basis of the data provided, we inform you :

2021-02-03 you created a PURNOJAHAKKA account at Stelario Casino. 

On 2021-05-29, you have requested in a letter to close your gaming login PURNOJAHAKKA due to gaming addiction. 

2021-05-29 your login PURNOJAHAKKA was closed as per your request and you were notified about it.

2022-03-18 you created an account PURNOJAHAKKA at Winstoia Casino. 

During the check of your account by casino security service, it was found that when you register your account PURNOJAHAKKA at Winstoia casino, you intentionally specified other data (email address / phone number / residential address / postal code). Our casino has an implemented mechanism that blocks the registration of players who were closed due to gambling addiction. This mechanism takes into account players' personal data. In your case, you have deliberately bypassed the blocking mechanism.

In connection with all of the above, you willfully violated the paragraph of the rules:

 7.5. If a player closes his casino account due to "problems with gambling" / "loss of self-control over the game" / "gambling addiction", in this case, the player is prohibited from playing on the sites of the casino partners, which are indicated in the license of this casino.

The player undertakes not to open a new account. The casino is not responsible for opening by you a new account and any losses that you may incur after opening a new account. We reserve the right at any time to close an account that was created on violation of these rules.

As you have violated rule point 7.5. Your account PURNOJAHAKKA at Winstoia Casino has been closed. Refunds of deposits, in this case, are not provided, as a casino rule, you violated deliberately.

If necessary, we can provide the administration of the forum, with the facts that you willfully pointed out other data when registering an account in such a way violated paragraph 7.5 in order to claim a return of your deposits.

Nice. So you dont block automaticly so peole will lose more money and you wont refund. Nice term. "Our casino has an implemented mechanism that blocks the registration of players who were closed due to gambling addiction. This mechanism takes into account players' personal data. In your case, you have deliberately bypassed the blocking mechanism."

I have same details on stelario and still no block. So its my fault that system doesnt block?

if casino takes deposits i should gotten to withdraw also of i wouldve won.

So in short . When some one makes account ( has allready closed accounts on sister sites). Casino accepts deposits and deposits. But closes account not sooner than when person conforts casino about it. Then that rule about

"We reserve the right at any time to close an account that was created on violation of these rules." That doesnt add up.

And if the only different detail is address. People move and over 1 year between stelario and winstoria. Same email .

Still i demand refund of deposits. Guru what you think about this?

Thank you, Winstoria Casino, for providing a detailed explanation.

Could you please send me the necessary data to my email (branislav.b@casino.guru)? We would like to see the personal data for the player's account in Stelario Casino and his data in Winstoria's Casino account. What was the player's balance in Winstoria Casino at the time he contacted Winstoria Casino Customer Support about the situation?

Block should be done by email. I bet theres same email , name and phone number on stelario. Address is different because i moved few months ago. How is it possible to change stelario casinos CLOSED account details i ask?

if the only diffenrence in details is home address i do not approve.

Block should be done by email address. Block should come automaticly when i registred.

Dear Purnojahakka,

Casinos only find out information about a player's identity during the verification process.

If I am not wrong, you did not pass the complete casino verification process and you were not allowed to create a casino account. The casino's terms and conditions are clear. If you have changed your address, this does not mean that you can register, especially using the system settings that allow it. I would like to wait for the casino's response and the details I request from the casino in my previous post.

Dear Branislav.

According to your request were sent the facts that the player has indicated other data when registering an account in Winstoria casino.

At the time of the player's closure on 2022-03-19, there were no funds on the player's balance or an active request for withdrawal.

I wanna see the details. If only difference is home address and post code. I wont give up.

Hello, Purnojahakka,

I am afraid we are not allowed to provide you with the data without the casino's approval.

Your home address and zip code are not the only information you have filled in Winstoria differently.

There was a different email used (not luukku.com, as you stated on casino.guru) and the phone number was also written in a different format (one more number was added).

Dear Winstoria Casino Team,

Thank you for the data, I confirm I received your email and checked the attachments carefully.

Although the user used different data for registration in Winstoria Casino, the system allowed him to go through and play in the casino with the same name, surname and date of birth. These are the main and changeless data valid for each player. If the terms and conditions say it is not allowed, it should be enforced by the system.

On what basis and personal data does the system recognize a potentially blocked player, please?

I can see in the provided data the player was able to sign up with the same personal data. Email, address or phone number are personal details that can be changed from time to time. If the system allowed him to register, it is not set correctly.

There is another thing - You referred to rule 7.5 above. I also found it at Stelario Casino. The rule says that "the player is prohibited from playing on the sites of the casino partners, which are indicated in the license of this casino." Winstoria Casino is not stated in the list under the license on the Stelario website (see the attached screenshot from the license validator). Winstoria Casino has a separate license validator that does not show other casinos.

How does a self-excluded player in Stelario Casino know that Winstoria Casino is its "sister" casino and the self-exclusion is also valid in Winstoria Casino?

If there is any communication between the casino and the player requesting to close the account at Stelario or another sister casino, including the player's explanation, could you please send it to my email?

You claimed that the system would not allow the player to register with the same email and/or other data. In case it is possible and the casino store this type of information, are there any records of the player's failed attempts to sign up with the same email address?

Email is differend? Weird because when i try to log in to stelario with luukku.com it gives that blocked due gambling problem text..

in red box it says in finnish. On both casinos its same email.

Casino just doesnt want to refund me. Email address is same on both casinos as u can see.

Dear Purnojahakka,

The complaint regards Winstoria Casino, not Stelario. You used a different email to sign up in Winstoria, that's why the system allowed it. However, we are waiting for the casino's response.

One more note - Winstoria Casino is not mentioned under the license on Stelario Casino's website with other casinos. Therefore I mentioned that in one of my last posts. If you are self-excluded in Stelario Casino, it does not mean you are automatically self-excluded in Winstoria Casino (the license does not require that) and you should request a self-exclusion in Winstoria Casino separately. If I am not wrong, this was not done. It is the casino's goodwill your account was closed immediately and I am afraid we cannot do much to help you with your issue. But, it also depends on the casino's statement and the details I requested from the casino.

Yes but i never asked my account to be closed at winstoria. I mentioned that i have closed accounts under same licence . Chat just closed my account. I Didint close it. If this is this winstoria account should be opened.

Yes, and you mentioned that it happened because of a gambling problem and that significantly changes the situation.

Now I am not sure if I understand your expectations. Do you expect a reopened account with a 0€ balance? That probably will not be possible.

No. I guess just let this go. Never gonna get my deposits back casino always wins these situations. Always players fault.

Dear Branislav,

We appreciate your investigations, but you don't see the obvious reason.

You have evidence, screenshots, where you can see that the client deliberately added one digit in the phone number, used a different email address, although they are similar, also indicated one extra digit in the post code, we are more than sure that the client did it intentionally to bypass the blocking.

This is not the first such complaint, and your employees did themselves such a check on our project and partner sites, and they were blocked at the stage of registration. This has been confirmed. 

In the current situation, the customer intentionally made a registration with other data. The client's account will not be opened, since the client has a game addiction. And the client confirmed it. 

If you don't see the obvious facts that the client did it on purpose, we're sorry. In this case, let the client appeal to the licensing authority, but we are sure that it will be useless, because all the evidence against the client and it is obvious that the client entered other data on purpose, as the system did not allow him to register with his data under which his account is closed on the partner's site. 

Dear Winstoria Casino Team,

Although the final decision was already made, I would like to explain it from our point of view.

You claim you are more than sure the client did it intentionally to bypass the blocking, but, it is hard to prove it. Therefore, I asked you for additional data above. Moreover, the player filled in his real name, surname and date of birth in the registration form. If this was correctly enforced by the system, as you stated, it would not be enforced based on personal data which can be changed from time to time, especially in the case a long time elapsed between the registrations in different casinos. The casino found out that the player is self-excluded in the sister casino only based on his information provided to the customer support. We do not know whether he knew this really earlier than he lost his money. But, we know he has a gambling problem.

In case you would like to refer to your rule about sister casinos - there is no information anywhere that Winstoria Casino is the sister casino of Stelario Casino. Then it does not make any sense to refer to this rule and/or to turn to the regulator.

A more important factor led us to the final decision - the fact the player informed you that he has closed accounts in another casino due to a gambling problem, and the fact that he would have to have a separately closed account due to a gambling problem at Winstoria Casino if he wanted to refer to the rule about self-exclusion.

The point is the player has a gambling problem and he informed the casino about it. He had lost his money and tried to use the rule about self-exclusion and tried to request his deposit to be refunded. I think I do not have to explain it in more detail.

In addition, there is no reason to refer to any other complaints here. Every case is somehow specific and I do not know what were the results of the investigation and the circumstances of any other complaint and why it was decided in that way.

Conclusion - The player registered at Winstoria Casino and lost his funds. The casino acted correctly and within its Responsible Gaming policy rules when closed the player's account due to a gambling problem.

Dear Purnojahakka,

Unfortunately, after gathering all the necessary information, it was decided the complaint will be rejected. Sorry, we were not able to help you with this one, but please, do not hesitate to contact us in the future, if you run into any issues with this or any other casino. We are here to help.

If you are not satisfied with the complaint solution, I recommend you consult the gambling authority that the casino is regulated by.

Thank you, Winstoria Casino Team, for your replies and for providing information.

Best regards,

Branislav, Casino.Guru