The player from Germany was accused of breaching the maximum allowed bet. The casino confiscated his winnings and refunded the last deposit. We ended up closing the complaint as unresolved because the casino failed to provide all relevant evidence and stopped responding.
Kaulana Casino - Player's winnings were confiscated.
Black points: 1168
Amount: €1,101
Kaulana Casino
Safety Index:Very lowSafety Index
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3.2
Kaulana Casino has a Safety Index of 3.2, which means some of the considered factors point to a very low level of safety. Explore this casino’s Safety Index
Unresolved
Our verdict
Insufficient evidence from casino
UNRESOLVED
Case summary
1 year ago
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1 year ago
Translation
Hello, good evening ,
When I got a promotion email from Kahuna today, I went into the casino and saw that my balance of €1101 was still in the account, which was unusual because I always request a payout after my wagering.
When I then looked at the payout history, I saw that my payout was cancelled, when I clicked on the live chat there was no live chat, I just wrote a small text account and selected the topic. I asked in the existing field why my withdrawal was cancelled, I got a reply to my email after about 20 seconds and when I read it I went back to the casino and I saw that my real money balance was confiscated immediately.
So how it came to my credit.
I played with a 50% bonus on 02/22/2023 and deposited €150 and I cashed out €1101 after wagering on 02/23/2023 and requested a withdrawal. I have read the bonus terms and conditions thoroughly and now my withdrawal has been declined and the €1101 balance has been confiscated and my real money deposit has been returned to my casino account balance.
According to the bonus terms, the maximum wager is €5 or 10% of the deposit or 10% of the bonus balance, whichever is lower.
Since I deposited €150, 10% of that is €15
My bonus was a 50% deposit bonus I deposited €150, of which 50% are €75 bonus credit of €75 bonus credit is 10% €7.5,
the lower value is valid, so the maximum bet is 5€, I also checked my game history again and no, I didn't play more than 5€, screenshots are available from the game history. I contacted the casino personally and wrote an email.
I ask for help and for a statement from Kahuna, otherwise my winnings were always paid out, it may be a system error or a player mix-up. Please give me an answer
Thank you dear Casinoguru team thank you Kahuna Casino.
Kind regards, Thomas h.
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1 year ago
Dear thomash95,
Thank you very much for submitting your complaint. I’m sorry to hear about your negative experience. I checked the bonus T&Cs and I found this:
"1.23 The maximum bet with active bonus €/$ 5.00, 50 SEK/NOK or 10% of their current available balance (whichever is lower) on a given round or spin when using bonuses or winnings generated from bonuses (but the 10% rule does not apply to bet sizes under €/$ 0.50, 5 SEK/NOK). Betting a larger proportion of one’s balance on a single round or game can lead to the voiding of this particular bonus and winnings and voiding of subsequent bonuses and winnings. Repeated abuse can lead to account termination and confiscation of balances."
Our position is closely explained in Fair Gambling Codex https://casino.guru/fair-gambling-codex-for-casinos#max-bets: The max bet rule is, in fact, an industry-standard, just as the fact that a casino has the right to seize the player's winnings from bonus play after breaking this rule. We prefer not to go against industry standards by penalizing casinos that use the maximum bet rule against players from time to time.
However, if you feel like you have been accused mistakenly, feel free to forward me your full game history together with a link to the specific bonus that you redeemed and played. My email address is kristina.s@casino.guru.
If there is any relevant communication between you and the casino, please send it as well.
Thank you in advance for your reply.
Best regards,
Kristina
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1 year ago
Translation
Good day, thank you for your answer. I read the bonus terms and conditions before playing. That's right. I will email you. Thanks!
I deposited €150 for the 50% welcome back bonus
Deposit 150€ = 10% = 15€ the smaller value is 5€ max bet
Bonus credit 75 € = 10% = 7.5 € the smaller value is 5 € max bet.
During this bonus I only played 1 game and won there my lowest balance was 75€ when I won so 75€=10% clause are also 7.5€ so 5€ max bet is legal and the 10% clause has no effect in this case because the smallest value always counts and that is 5 €!
You can see screenshots, gameplay as well, I'll send you that by email thank you!
I am fully verified I have already received a payout!
Now my prize has been cancelled! although I can't spot any errors I'll keep you posted
Best regards
thomas h
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1 year ago
Thank you for your reply, thomash95. Do I understand correctly based on your email that you did in fact breach the maximum allowed bet?
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1 year ago
Translation
That's right, I'm supposed to have violated the max. bet rule, unfortunately the casino doesn't want to pay out the balance, I got my deposit refunded and I had it paid out, now unfortunately I don't understand why the (10% or €5 lower value applies )max bet rules apply permanently, that means if I have a balance of 100€ and play with a bonus, I can bet 5€ from a balance of less than 50€, no longer bet more than 5€ so I have to play with every spin calculate so that I don't violate the 10% rule because my balance is under €50, so it's no fun to play then I really have to check and calculate every spin and change the stake after several spins if my balance/credit is under €50 am worth, I like to play with 5€/max bet. but it's no fun playing that way, then you just sit at the slot and have to calculate in your head instead of simply observing and having fun!
Well, when I played this bonus 50%, according to my game history, I did not get below a value of €75 and that was the lowest value, so I did everything right for this bonus and in this game with this deposit, but they just gave me canceled the profit because I played the 2 other bonuses (deposit with bonus) down to 0€ credit with a bet of 5€ and that was the error I didn't know you didn't get an email or a notification because you did something wrong Winnings were simply confiscated due to previous violation of bonus terms and conditions. but the funny thing is i get emails to play and i get bonuses...!
You just wait until you win something and then you can confiscate the prize. I find that really sad!
Thank you for your understanding. Good evening, best regards, Thomas h.
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1 year ago
Translation
10% of the current bonus or deposit amount, yes I assumed that, but unfortunately the 10% (stake rule) is the permanent balance during the game, so how should I say: every balance value after every spin has another max bet stake! With large credits/balance on the player account, this is clear, but as soon as the value falls below €50, the calculation starts and a wrong click with a wrong bet means a canceled win and future wins are also confiscated, so that’s it very, very petty stuff and extremely difficult to control, that's no fun and is very dangerous! other players must be warned of such a situation!
I didn't know that either and reading it doesn't help either because it's well described in the bonus conditions, these are puns and no clear words so that the player understands it....
Thank you Good evening Thomas h.
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1 year ago
Thank you very much, thomash95, for your cooperation. I will now transfer your complaint to my colleague Peter (peter.m@casino.guru) who will be at your service. I wish you the best of luck and hope the problem will be resolved to your satisfaction in the near future.
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1 year ago
Hi thomash95,
I have looked at your case and understand the situation. Let me contact the casino and I will do my best to help. I would like to invite Kahuna Casino to the conversation to participate in the resolution of this complaint.
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1 year ago
We would like to ask the casino to reply to this complaint. We are extending the timer by 7 days. If the casino fails to respond in the set time frame, we will close the complaint as ‘unresolved’ which may negatively affect its rating.
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1 year ago
Hello,
sorry about the delay.
The player's winnings have had to be voided because he broke the terms related to wagering over 10% of his balance.
He did so repeatedly with multiple bonuses prior to that last one and hence the play had to be voided.
As our terms state: "Betting a larger proportion of one’s balance on a single round or game can lead to the voiding of this particular bonus and winnings and voiding of subsequent bonuses and winnings. Repeated abuse can lead to account termination and confiscation of balances."
Emphasis added for clarity.
Please note that the 10% rule applies to the balance value, not the deposit value. Therefore having deposited 50eur is not the factor in determining the bet size.
If the balance goes to 40 eur, the bet size needs to be adjusted to 4 eur to respect our rules.
Best regards,
the Kahuna Casino team
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1 year ago
Translation
Hello,
Unfortunately, I did not know that this applies as they said in their emphasis and clarification:
(Kahuna) - Emphasis added for clarity.
Please note that the 10% rule applies to the balance, not the deposit value. Therefore, the deposit of 50 euros is not the factor in determining the bet size.
If the balance is 40 euros, the bet size needs to be adjusted to 4 euros to comply with our rules.
I have always deposited €150 each and played with bonuses 50% at least. andd played with 5€ until my balance was 0€. If I had known that I would have to change my bet from 4 euros then to 3 euros then to 2 € because my credit value is 40 € or then 30 € or then 20 € I would have done this too,
Unfortunately, this simplified text that you gave as an example is not in the bonus conditions! Every player understands that. If you look at the 10% clause or €5 value, players assume that they mean the lower value with the real money or bonus money, these conditions apply. For example, a €150 real money deposit with a 50% bonus would be worth:
Real money150€ : 10% clause or 5€ max bet rule value = (150€ 10% = 15€) max bet rule 5€ would be the lower value
and at this bonus of 50% with a deposit of 150€
Bonus balance €75 10% clause or €5 max bet rule value= (€75 10% = €7.5) max bet rule if the smaller value (€5) was less than 10%
but as i told you before, this is not a nice limitation when the 10% is permanent on every current balance after every spin.
This is correct as I can see in your game history as I received a screenshot via email, I played the previous games when I fell below a value of €50 playing a bet of €5 but I assumed that was the starting amount or the bonus amount at the beginning of it 105 or 5€ max bet rule does not apply to the permanent value of the balance after each spin it applies.
In this regard, I also find it a clear impertinence, as it also says in their BONUS CONDITIONS: Repeated misuse can lead to the termination of the account and confiscation of credit. "
Then why are they giving me deposit bonuses after 2 unknowing breaches of these bonus terms and conditions? So that they confiscate my winnings! I would have accepted a lot more an email because I violated bonus conditions and my account was closed, but it is worse to simply confiscate the money after the wagering and how is it still possible to play with a bonus in your casino and the pay out winnings?
because the terms and conditions say winnings can be confiscated from the following bonuses!
purely theoretically in the future not at all anymore because profits are confiscated now and every time one makes 1-2 times a mistake and the remaining future profits can always and will always be confiscated.
you will be punished for the future always and every time because this right is permanent.
For this reason I will no longer play at Kahuna and you lose a player and please change the BONUS CONDITIONS and write it correctly with a small example as you named it here so that future players are warned and understand this rule, otherwise players and you will lose they don't get their money back it's unfair.
And I also wanted to tell you that my winnings in this deposit bonus of 50% real money deposit of 150 € the smallest balance of 75 € was in the game and the max bet rule is 5 €. since the smallest value there is lower than your 10% clause
and each deposit bonus is separate and cannot be compared to any other bonus, i regard my winnings as legal as i have not broken any rules for this bonus.
The previously used bonus that is correct, I made a bet of €5 with a credit value of €50 because, as I mentioned to you above, I did not know that my credit value after each spin was subject to the 10% clause or €5 max bet rule are valid
have a nice friendly day to you
Kind regards, Thomas h.
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1 year ago
Hi all,
Thank you for your replies.
Dear Kahuna Casino team,
Could you please send the player's game history (and mark the overbets) to my email address (peter.m@casino.guru)?
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1 year ago
Translation
I checked the game histories 2 times on my win of €1101 I had the lowest bankroll value of €75 in a game that is not Cherrypop (Yggdrasil) and not Black Hawk Deluxe (Wazdan) but another (Yggdrasil) play that to one another day is (separate bonus and separate deposit) with the 2 previous bonuses so before my win I played cherrypop and and black hawk deluxe and there it is true I played ignorantly under a value of 50€ balance 5€ although I there I played a 50% bonus with a deposit of €150, this is charged to me because I made a bet of €5 in the previous games and deposit bonuses with a value of less than €50.
I can also send you the game history if you need it, thanks and have a good day, best regards
thomas h
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1 year ago
Hello Thomash,
please note that the breach happened on previous bonuses as already explained and that's what caused the void as per our terms.
@Peter, we send you an email with the proofs, please check.
thanks,
the Kahuna Casino Team
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1 year ago
Dear Kahuna Casino Team,
thank you for the provided evidence. I have some additional questions. I've looked at the game history and correct me if I'm wrong but the player didn't win anything with those overbets right? Secondly, what do you mean by: "please note that the breach happened on previous bonuses"?
Did you confiscate the player's winnings from this bonus because they breached the max bet rule playing with the previous bonuses?
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1 year ago
We would like to ask the casino to reply to this complaint. We are extending the timer by 7 days. If the casino fails to respond in the set time frame, we will close the complaint as ‘unresolved’ which may negatively affect its rating.
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1 year ago
Hello,
as the document that we shared with you shows, the player bet over the limit allowed by our terms, did so repeatedly and therefore the winnings have had to be voided in accordance to these terms. Note that these terms are in place to prevent bonus abuse and therefore we must apply these rules in all cases for it to be effective for its purpose.
This case is very clear and the breach acknowledged by the player so in our view this case is resolved.
Best regards,
Kahuna Casino team
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1 year ago
Translation
Hello, thanks since I did this unknowingly and not knowing that the permanent value of the balance refers to the 10%/5€ max bet rule, I made this mistake with previous bonuses because I assumed a starting value of the deposit or bonus balance am.
Unfortunately, I also don't understand why they gave me bonuses anyway if they didn't want to and didn't pay me these winnings, because they would have confiscated them anyway.
Now a simple example in the bonus terms would be of great help to future players, unfortunately they see this as too much work and too big a costly factor. everyone would understand a small arithmetic example of the bonus condition, but unfortunately they and their casino see this as a purely commercial commercial profitable business.
Future games should be warned if you see this post and read I wish you a happy holiday
Kind regards, Thomas h
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1 year ago
Hi all,
Thank you for your replies.
Dear Kahuna Casino team,
I'm not sure if I understand the player's game history because it's incomplete. Could you please send the whole game history and mark the beginning of the bonus and the end of the bonus he made the winnings of €1100 from? According to the screenshot you sent, I can see that overbets were made but it seems that Thomas lost almost all the funds he used for these bets. If he lost all the bets, how did he manage to win €1100?
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1 year ago
Translation
Hello Peter I want to tell you and clarify it so you can understand a bit. I used a deposit bonus and didn't win with that one there I played a madness game, after that I used another new deposit bonus and played a game from ygggdrasil (cherrypop) and didn't win either, and then about 1 week later I still have Used a deposit bonus and won with it and this was a different game so not a Wazdan game and not a game called cherrypop ! Each game was used with a different deposit bonus and to shed some light on the situation thanks I'm happy to help Best regards Thomas h.
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1 year ago
Translation
I correct wazdan, I meant that the game manufacturer doesn't mean madness*
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1 year ago
We would like to ask the casino to reply to this complaint. We are extending the timer by 7 days. If the casino fails to respond in the set time frame, we will close the complaint as ‘unresolved’ which may negatively affect its rating.
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1 year ago
Hello Thomash,
I received some response from a casino rep on Skype so I'd like to give the casino one more chance to reply to the complaint and possibly solve the issue. Let's wait a few more days and see if we can make some progress here.
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1 year ago
Translation
Thank you all right no problem good week to you 🙂
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1 year ago
Hello Thomash,
Unfortunately, it seems that the casino stopped responding entirely. I’m afraid there is not much that can be achieved without cooperation from its side. I will mark the complaint as "unresolved" in our system. I understand this isn't a satisfactory solution to your issue. However, the decrease in the rating caused by unresolved complaints might help to change the casino's approach. If the casino decides to respond and provide the necessary evidence, we will reopen the complaint, and you will be notified by email. In the meantime, I recommend you contact the Curacao Gaming Authority (certria@gaminglicences.com) and submit a complaint to them. The Gaming Authority has more options and tools to help players. Please let me know if you need help with submitting the complaint or how they responded if you can do it on your own (peter.m@casino.guru). I am sorry I could not be of more help on this occasion.
Best regards,
Peter
