Execution Pokerstars. Apparently, payment is not voluntary (page 110)

I agree with you there. But as we all know, the legal position has been clearly stated by the ECJ since 2009, that national governments decide for themselves how to implement this law. But you are right so far, one has one's expectations of the ruling. But we all know that the EU is a constitutional state, thank God, where everything takes time because everyone has the right to file lawsuits, no matter how pointless they may be. What must be criticized is that the ECJ did not simply repeat and confirm its views from 2009 in a brief advisory ruling, which would have nipped Bill 55 or all attempts by Malta in the bud. But that's how the rule of law works.

So the PKFS and lawyers have a business model and they also give enough commission.

As soon as the judgment has been made, it cannot be the case that the consumers have signed this contract and not seen any money, because no lawyer will wait five years for money, otherwise they would all be insolvent already.

I'm not angry, I just know that I've invested a lot of time and attended every hearing in which I was present and questioned for two hours, and I'm being fobbed off in the same way.

In addition, up until the time of the lawsuit, no one knew that these casinos were operating illegally in Austria because they advertised everywhere and sponsored clubs or are still sponsoring them with money...

patience or not...

Sooner or later, only those who sued early enough will get anything. Many casinos are already insolvent or simply make it difficult to get the money. That's a fact.

You can see from this whole issue how things work in the EU as long as everyone plays along.

It's just not communicated to the consumer in the way that it actually works, and that's exactly what it's all about now.

Not only do you wait two years for a judgment, you still don't have a title to enforce it, which I waited another 16 months for, you don't get paid, then proceedings are started in Malta and this takes years and even then the ECJ makes the decision and dictates that Malta should follow the judgment. Where are we then?

8 years? How can you advertise something like that when you already knew in 2021 that Malta does not enforce and then a law is passed there not to carry out the execution? It's all about the business model behind it and you can't really celebrate that anymore...

Furthermore, the lawyers would not have preferred larger sums to smaller ones with some providers, so of course they are also purely looking at the profit.

I'll tell you honestly, they advertise like no other in sports, TV, etc., I had no doubts about the legality. It's not only illegal but also very fraudulent.

Absolutely. But since we are a constitutional state, we should be happy that things are happening as they are. Everyone has the right to try everything until the last possible moment, both the plaintiff and the defendant. And things like that just drag on, given the overload of all courts in Europe.

I was lucky with the almost 60% at the beginning of 2020, after the LG Bremen ruling. It took less than 6 months from the first day of court, the lawsuits, to the payout at 888 and Bayton Ltd. Although I had already written off the money back then, before that. Even if everything was illegal, in retrospect, they assumed it was legal. So you write it off for now and don't worry about maybe getting something back, you didn't even need to play on these sites, regardless of whether they were legal or illegal. The money would have been gone with both of us, with all of us.

As I said, the money will be paid out, including interest, which will leave many a casino speechless.

Just believe in the rule of law. The wheels turn slowly, but they turn.

that's the way it is!

very few will get their money because the casinos will then have to reserve the interest in their balance sheet... so it will no longer be profitable and insolvency will be there. And the casinos really had MANY years to prepare for insolvency. I still think that a few judgements will be served, then insolvency filing and shortly before insolvency filing a general settlement with 30% or so and the lawyers have already earned money and then they will say "thank God we got 30% for you before the insolvency wave"

A lawyer (I have several lawsuits through various lawyers/PFs) said to me "the longer it takes, the lower the chance, because the defendants are also preparing"

The fact that some lawyers are pushing for 25% settlements also says something.

(Look at Drückglück, same homepage, same name, just different operators, formerly "Titanium Brace…" now "skill on net" casinos can continue to earn money and the plaintiffs all came away empty-handed, including me!!!)

I don't think Pokerstars or bet365 will file for bankruptcy.

I think that with the really big 888 ltd (I think they're called evoke now) and tsg, titpico and maybe bet 365... the chance is definitely much higher and less likely that they'll go bankrupt, but many others that have suddenly sprung up like mushrooms out of nowhere will disappear again very quickly and without paying, because you can never find out where the money is anyway and if you do, it's already too late and the masses can no longer be served.

Yes, that could be.

The operators with a German license will not file for bankruptcy.

Luckily, I only played for large companies.

Wish us all good luck.

How do you know that and where did you get the info?

That would be good. But I think this less profitable license is also somewhat overrated. If the mountain of debt (legally binding judgments) becomes too big, they simply close down. And then come back with a new name, perhaps, and reapply for the license. There are also casinos with a German license that have made millions in losses since the license was granted, but were previously highly profitable. Fewer players, low stake limits = less turnover = less profit = poor payment morale in the event of legally binding judgments = high risk of insolvency. The few very large market leaders will probably take it and pay up. The medium-sized and smaller operators could well go under en masse, however. We will soon see.

That may be true, everyone has to look at it for themselves, but they earn so many billions... a few hundred million won't destroy the business

So if at least 200 million in judgments have not been paid in Austria, how high is or will the sum be in Germany? You have a lot more inhabitants than Austria.

Also, in Germany the statute of limitations is 10 years and in Austria it is 30. That is also a very important point and they are sure to try out the statute of limitations tactic.

Let it be a few hundred million. Have you ever looked at what bet365, tipico, Pokerstars and co earn per year?

Also interesting haha

right now also bought losses as far as I know?! https://www.wiwo.de/unternehmen/dienstleister/flugverspaetungen-und-co-legaltech-start-up-rightnow-meldet-insolvenz-an/30230232.html

That's true, but you can only roughly estimate what they have on hand based on their reserves.

Besides, turnover does not equal profit and they certainly invest huge amounts of money in advertising etc.

They also want to pay as little as possible in losses to the people who lost there

https://www.juve.de/markt-und-management/pech-im-spiel-warum-rightnow-insolvenz-anmelden-musste/

https://m.bild.de/geld/wirtschaft/maschmeyer-start-up-pleite-verzockt-sich-die-klageindustrie-67af3b365cebf1765bab6b88?t_ref=android-app%3A%2F%2Fcom.google.android.googlequicksearchbox%2F

Are we fucked?

Well suddenly everyone is writing that they have good chances at the ECJ haha

How strange is that? You can only ask your own lawyer anyway, but if you do some research, one thing is clear: nothing is safe anymore

They probably simply underestimated the time it would take to advance all the costs and miscalculated. Every other PKF continues to accept cases in Germany.